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Yamaha Breeze

Postby rob319 » Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:36 am

Hi to all!
I have several questions as a newbie with ATV's.
My son recently traded for a Yamaha Breeze. It was pretty rough but runs pretty good.
After a couple of day's of riding, the rear swing arm broke at the front welds. I am about to tear it down and try to repair and fix it up some.
I would appriciate any recomendations for parts sources.
Do all the yamaha dealers really charge the list prices shown on there websites for parts? I mean $200 for a shock and $70 for chain seem high.
I will probably try to weld the rear arm (unless I can find a bike to salvage from) but will need to by the following:
Rear Shock, carburator Kit, Plug, Filters, Seat, Front Sprocket and Chain, Grips and Rear Brake Pads.
Where is the best place to shop for these parts?
If everything must come through a dealer at list price I should have just bought him a new bike:) Thats the way it goes....
He seems to be hooked on the 4 wheeler now so I have to get to work.
Thanks for any ideas or comments,
Rob
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Postby raptor8 » Mon Sep 26, 2005 12:56 am

Rob you may have luck scouting for parts for it besides the dealer, and i'll bet you're gonna get good at it... If he wants to ride you're better off getting something newer so he can ride [nothing taiwanese or korean, no matter whose name is on it!] if you stick with yamaha or honda youll be OK. a lot of the other companies are rebadging JUNK from taiwan and korea. I am NOT impressed! their names rhyme with chawasaki and chewzuki, but I cant say who they are....shame!
the Breeze is still around as the raptor **, now part of the raptor family.
First decide if it is worth saving. Then scout the new stuff and see what you're in for [i recommend new - it doesnt hurt THAT bad] and sell the breeze as a parts bike or buy another wherever. word of mouth works best IMHO. usually in staging areas.......
Getting the kid riding something safe is the point right? Buy a Major NAME new or nearly new and you'll be able to sell it if you maintain it possibly at a profit. See any GOOD kids quads in the classifieds? not for long right? same here, and we're in a small town.
take a camera with ya to the dealership, cuz you'll never see that face on your child again....the surprise, the wonder, the gratitude...it's all worth it, I've seen it on many kids and it tears me up every time. the ' OH BOY' follwed by the hug and the ' THANKS DAD' are priceless. go for it. :wink:
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Yamaha Breeze

Postby rob319 » Tue Sep 27, 2005 12:34 am

Thanks for the quick reply.
I am going to allow myself $200 to $300 for parts and unlimted sweat and labor to get this going so he can learn to ride a little more with it. After that it will be a new one. I would like to get by till maybe Christmas.
I have it all torn down and will start searching for various parts. Hopefully I will get it going within a couple of weeks so my son can quit asking whats next, how long etc... :)
Actually we had alot of fun taking it apart together, some real quality time and a chance for him to learn a little more mechanical stuff.
Of course im still learning to and im 42;)
Thanks again,
Rob
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Postby gmack221 » Tue Sep 27, 2005 11:25 am

Thats a point thats missed alot "quality time" & "teaching him". If you don't teach him how to work on things who will? If you don't teach him to check the oil & gas before riding it, and it blows up because it had no oil in it, who's really to blame? ATV's are great to teach kids how to diagnois a problem, what it takes to fix the minor things, and what maintence is required, and best of all, if they are broke down its not the end of the world, you can take your time fixing them and teaching while doing so.

New ATV's are nice, but teaching a kid how to fix them is priceless, might help him out when his first car breaks down at 2am, rather then getting you out of bed he might be able to figure out which wire came off, ect... Not only that but they learn just because something doesn't run that doesn't mean you need a new one, it means you need to find out why it don't run!
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Yamaha Breeze & Hard to Start

Postby rob319 » Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:25 am

Thanks for the encouragement.
After several days of hard labor we have the ATV back together and everything looks good. :D
I could use some advice about getting this thing started as it is very, very cold natured.
I took the carburetor apart and cleaned it thoroughly and was hoping that this would make it easier to start. Although it was very dirty, it did not make it any easier to get started. I was careful to put all the adjustments back where they were except for the idle screw which I moved a little.
The best method seems to be to use full choke and run the starter over and over with little or no throttle and after 3 or 4 minutes it will begin to fire faintly and by then thumbing the throttle rapidly (but not very far at all) it will eventually kick off (after 3 or 4 minutes more) and with some fancy finger work keep going until it worms up. After it has wormed up for awhile it will the start fine for the rest of the day.
I am going to order and owners manual which will be useful I’m sure, but any ideas or suggestions to help us out before we end up burning up the starter motor would be really appreciated.
It seems to be getting plenty of gas as I see it in the intake. It kind of seems like if I could pull the choke out a little more it would help?
Thanks again!
Rob
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Postby raptor8 » Fri Sep 30, 2005 1:38 pm

well those little guys didnt have a partcularly strong spark when they were new, but your prob sounds like carburetion. put a nice new spark plug in there anyway JIC. carb problems on those are common if they have set awhile. you might check the petcock for flow too as I have seen a couple of those plug up.
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Postby gmack221 » Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:11 pm

#1 make sure your getting plenty of gas from the shut off valve
#2 test spark with a spark tester (any autozone has them that you can adjust the gap to match the plug gap).
#3 check compression (or have it checked at a shop).

since you say it takes several mins to get it started it makes me believe you have low compression, either worn out piston rings or valve adjustment / carbon built up on the valves. If its piston rings it would probably smoke alot when its running.

Is the breeze the 80cc yamaha quad? If it is most likely its your valve adjustment (comon problem). My brother piceked up an 80cc quad for my nephews that wouldn't start, I believe its the exhaust valve that always tightens up on these motors and doesn't allow it to build compression, therefore makes them impossible to start. If you don't already have one pick up a Clymer book for the right valve clearance specs.

Valve adjustment (its easy and here's an overview)

- take screw on covers off valve cover
- turn motor over until you see both valves open and close (they open one at a time, just make sure your not adjusting on the lobe of the cam)
- using a wrench (usually 10 mm) back off lock nut
- adjust until feeler gauge has slight resistance on it
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Postby raptor8 » Fri Sep 30, 2005 2:26 pm

good point gmack! the valves are usually ignored on these and it is fairly common to find a tight one [i found an intake valve that wasnt closing yesty on a recon] its runs way better now hehe. theyre very simple to adjust and could be a big part of your puzzle.
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Yamaha Breeze

Postby rob319 » Sat Oct 01, 2005 3:18 am

Thanks for the suggestions,
I do have plenty of fuel from the shut-off valve.
I was not able to get the spark checked so far, but I did install a new plug, and it looks to be firing very well.
I will have to find a shop that can check the compression. It does smoke a little, nothing that I would say is allot but it does smoke lightly.
The Yamaha Breeze has a 125cc engine.
After the repairs and a few new parts it is all back together now and we are very happy with it. My son would be very happy with this one for quite awhile if it would just start a little easier. After it finally starts it runs well, but I should point out that it has a very slight hesitation when you gun the throttle before it takes off and while it idles very smooth, if you let it sit at idle it will drift to a little faster or a little slower over time.
I don't have a book yet to know how to adjust the valves, but I took one cover off (one screw on cover, sealed by an O ring on each side of the spark plug, right?) and could not determine when it was "open" or where I could measure a gap?
This is probably over my head, but that usually doesn't stop me:)
Is there somewhere on-line or is it possible to describe the adjustment procedure in more depth?
If I definitely need to back off the nuts, I could do each a turn at a time and then test.....
Trying to understand the valve purpose in my head, I found the following link: http://www.grc.nasa.gov/WWW/K-12/airplane/engopt.html
which shows each valve opening at different times. One opens to let air/fuel in and the other opens to let exhaust out?
Should I adjust out (loosen the nut) both valves so that they open more?
Sorry to be so basic here, but I catch on pretty quick with a little kick in the right direction.
Thanks,
Rob
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Postby raptor8 » Sat Oct 01, 2005 5:34 am

remove the spark plug, take those caps off and watch the engine turn. when one reaches the top of its travel is when you should be able to grab the rocker and tap it back and forth. if no sound then too tightee. loosen.
same with exhaust. i'll bet theyre both tight and after you do that it starts right up! you are gonna be shocked! Meanwhile, if it doesnt have CLEAN oil in it, have the boy do that while you are tinkering with the valves...
As others have said, it's either valves or rings, and if it's rings it's whipped. BUT valves are so often overlooked that it is where I would start.
I had good luck with that 02 recon i tuned yesty - never been serviced - the owner was riding wheelies with it tonite when i delivered it - big ole grin! :wink:
just basic maintenance man, and some observations over time.
youre on the right track.
let me know if I can help you.

;p

:D
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Yamaha Breeze

Postby rob319 » Sat Oct 01, 2005 10:56 pm

Thanks for the continued support!
I have been researching valve adjustment and am about to get started (half the work is removing shrouding). In the meantime I got a compression tester and have found that it will produce 50 to 65 psi. the high end is if we push the throttle in while cranking. I do not know what it should be yet, The only reference book I have found will have to be ordered over the internet monday (I won't be able to wait of course), so I do not know if that is a normal pressure range. Other engine references I found were about 100 psi so I figure it is on the low end. In any case I now have a reference point to start with.
If this doesn't work I guess it will be up for sale as it would probably be money better spent towards a new bike. Hopefully this will help out and this one will be a good starter bike to beat around on before we invest in the new one.
Thanks again,
Rob
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Yamaha Breeze - IT WORKS:)

Postby rob319 » Mon Oct 03, 2005 1:08 am

Just wanted to say thanks to you guy's.
I found that the exhaust valve was loose but the intake valve was a little tight. After I loosened it up (I set both at about .005 clearance) the compression went from 50 to 65 psi all the way up to 120 to 160 psi!
Started right up first try. I was way impressed!
My son say's to say thanks also, and he also told me last night that he was going to miss having to work on the 4 wheeler every night.....
I am not kidding, he/we have been having fun.
He has also caught the tool buying bug, and now has in own welding hood (with red flames painted on it) and gloves and I predict there will be many more projects in our shop soon.
The only problem with the ATV is a hesitation in acceleration if you punch it fast, it dogs down. As long as you accelerate smooth it takes off quick.
Hopefully we can troubleshoot that after we get the service manual.
Thanks again, you guys are great!
Rob
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Postby raptor8 » Mon Oct 03, 2005 1:41 am

you are certainly welcome my friends, any time. NOW you need to post some pictures! 8)

let me know how it goes with the hesitation - we'll all be happy to help if possible.

another smilin KID and happy DAD! hehe mission accomplished! WELL DONE ATVFAN MEMBERS! :mrgreen:
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Postby gmack221 » Mon Oct 03, 2005 12:56 pm

Great to hear you got it starting better & that you and your son had fun doing it. You do know now the next project is one for Dad right?

Check your plug to make sure its a redish brown color, if its white your too lean, if its black your too rich. If adjustment is needed you do it thru the slide needle in the carb. (the slide attaches to the thoratle cable).

As for the bogging when you try to accelerate, all thats needed is some air screw adjusment on the carb. There should be 2 screws on the carb, one for idle adjustment, one for air (usually on the bottom front side of the carb). Small adjustments here make a big difference! Bump up the idle and turn it one way until it starts to miss, then go the other way until it misses, now find the middle, then play with it a bit at different rpms. Make sure it still starts good after adjusting, once its set you will not need to mess with it again, but they can be a pain to get just right but its worth the time and kids feel important when you have them take it for a test ride!
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Yamaha Breeze

Postby rob319 » Fri Oct 07, 2005 2:20 am

Thanks for the suggestions,
I was just able to get back to working on the ATV tonight.
I checked the plug and it was black, almost wet looking. Since this would be a sign of too rich I removed the slide needle and moved the holding clip up one notch (there are 5 notches and it was on the 3rd) so the needle would set lower into the carb, thinking this would limit fuel.
After the move it became hard to start and ran rough no matter what I tried. I then moved the clip down one notch below the original middle position and it seemed better so I went ahead and moved it down to the bottom notch so that the needle is at it "highest" position. It runs and starts very good and I ended up adjusting the air screw all the way in and back out 1/4 turn which seems to be the best but I am not sure there is much difference between 1/4 and 3/4 out.
The hesitation is still there but much much less, just an abbreviated stall if you punch it fast before it will just start to bog down and then it takes off!
I would say it is 10 times better than what it was and I may try to tweak it a little more tomorrow to get an instant response. I may also try a little premium fuel?
We re-checked the plug and it was still very dark, but also dry as a bone and I will have to check it again as we did not really ride it enough to really test the plug. I am sure it will be more lean because it now smokes very very little if at all.
I had to leave the idle a little higher than what I thought it should be as the idle speed will still "drift" a little and acceleration is much better set fast than with a low idle.
I also think that the top end speed seems a little faster now.
Thanks again and by the way I tried to post a pic in the yamaha photo section, hopefully I did it right:)
Rob
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